6 T/B intake manifold.

EB Pete · 07-07-2006, 06:44 PM

well here it is:

one of me mates got the pic off the fordmods website. i haven't read the whole write up on it yet, but if i can remember correctly a place in sydney called rpd has just started making them. i'll see if i can find a link to the thread. what do yas think?

Kenaz · 07-07-2006, 07:10 PM

Interesting...

I wonder how effective it would be?

XRated · 07-07-2006, 07:18 PM

Yeah there's a thread or two on it over at fordmods.

EB Pete · 07-07-2006, 07:27 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by XRated

Yeah there's a thread or two on it over at fordmods.

yeah i'm reading it at the moment. it's mixed in with all there cams and there plug n play ms2. sounds pretty good though.

BLKPHN · 07-07-2006, 08:40 PM

damn that look impressive!! whout what some serious head work to make use of it.

JUZXR8 · 08-07-2006, 02:54 PM

damn...that looks iompressive....what sort or work would oyu need to take advantage of it thougH?....very impressive

mcflux · 09-07-2006, 07:56 PM

I luff it! :evilking:

fo3oz · 09-07-2006, 09:20 PM

interesting, but utterly pointless.
edit:
downsides:
1) you still have to make a plenum to get cold filtered air to all the inlets.
2) you have to balance all those bastards so they flow the exact same amount of air.
3) maintenance: more sources of possible future air leaks, more spindles to wear etc

upsides:
1) none (I was going to say for looks, but it looks like a real ghetto mod)

see where the fuel injectors are? thats where the fuel mixes with the air. It does not matter how the air gets to them, you could have a single 100mm butterfly throttle body, it doesn't matter. Thats why all efi cars just have the single butterfly.
In the old days of carby, you couldn't have one big throttle body, because you needed high air speed for the venturi effect. Also fuel mixed with the air at the inlet, so less fuel was carried to cylinders further away from the carby/s.
So for high flow eg max revs & hp,and to get even mixtures and good atomisation, multiple carbs were best. You put up with the extra maintenance and balancing for that reason.
Those problems don't occur with efi set ups which have the injectors at the ends on the manifold or in the cylinder head, thats why most efi set ups from the 70s no matter what manfacturer just have the single butterfly throttle body.

Rowy,xr6 · 09-07-2006, 09:37 PM

Why would it be pointless, the inline sixes lone air, so why not give them more

Rowy,xr6 · 09-07-2006, 09:37 PM

Sorry, couldnt see the rest of that message, my bad

Perana · 09-07-2006, 09:39 PM

Must tell BMW that multiple TB manifolds are pointless....

EFFalcon · 09-07-2006, 10:08 PM

judging by the performance of a car that attended the E-Series Vic cruise today, the 6 t/b manifold is very effective.

09-07-2006, 11:23 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by EFFalcon

judging by the performance of a car that attended the E-Series Vic cruise today, the 6 t/b manifold is very effective.

dont know about the economy though

:

fo3oz · 09-07-2006, 11:46 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Perana XR8

Must tell BMW that multiple TB manifolds are pointless....

Well instead of just a casual offhand remark in the usual internet forum way, do you want to put some effort into telling me why they're are beneficial?

Perana · 09-07-2006, 11:59 PM

Being used in most forms of Motor Racing as well as Ferrari, BMW and many others using them for high performance engines is enough reason for me

fo3oz · 10-07-2006, 12:12 AM

Well I don't see them as being useful in any motor that doesn't rev that high. Just because they're used on race cars doesn't mean they have a purpose here.
I can see a purpose in race cars, eg the engine flows so much air that you'd need a single throttle body 200mm just so it doesn't restrict air flow. Thats so large it's not practical, fair enough have mutliple smaller ones.
But for a motor that at max revs a 100mm throttlebody wouldn't restrict the air flow, there is no point in multiple throttle bodies.
You're talking to guy that was the first and probably only guy in WA to put 2 40mm idf webers on a 13b while everyone else put a single 48ida, and I did that because I saw the benefit in a single intake for each inlet on carby systems. I also owned a mercedes v8 with single efi throttle body.

I mean following your logic, I saw a race car with a 3.5" exhaust, if I put that exhaust on my car it will go faster. :MrT_anim:

EFFalcon · 10-07-2006, 12:39 AM

race cars have extractors
race cars have tunable engine management

i guess because they're used on race cars they're just not needed on road cars.

multi throttle body manifolds have their place, its as simple as that.

Perana · 10-07-2006, 12:42 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by EFFalcon

multi throttle body manifolds have their place, its as simple as that.

Bingo!

It depends on the application as to what is better..

fo3oz · 10-07-2006, 01:06 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by EFFalcon

race cars have extractors
race cars have tunable engine management

i guess because they're used on race cars they're just not needed on road cars.

multi throttle body manifolds have their place, its as simple as that.

lame
Lets brings as many things into this as possible to cloud the issue. Race cars have carbon brake rotors, lets put them in street cars as they are obviously superior in every way. Race cars have straight cut gearboxes, im up for it in my street EL
It's where multi throttle body manifolds place is, is the issue we're dicussing.

EFFalcon · 10-07-2006, 01:13 AM

well you've said there is no advantages.
you are clearly wrong.
for out right power, they will provide more air flow, no ones saying they're superior in EVERY way, but they do have their place, maybe not stock or mild street cars.

[img]hxxp://www.deleted link/pics/eb/6tb.jpg[/img]

someone should tell this guy multi throttle body setups are useless on EFI cars.

1st Place - 1992 EB Falcon Fuel Injected
8 x throttle body injection: Custom engine modifications & tuning performed in house at Bob Romano Performance Motors
[img]hxxp://www.bobromano.com.au/images/gal_images/bobs_falcon2.jpg[/img]
Owner - Bob Romano

fo3oz · 10-07-2006, 01:22 AM

You misquote me, I said a single larger throttle body would be just as good, if you find the standard one restrictive.
And I was talking about the I6 one, I have no idea about whether the v8 needs the multi throttle body for performance, and whether a single throttle couldn't fit, big enough one not available etc, or whether romano did it just for looks.

you all seem to think that I'm saying there's no benefit at all. I'm not, I'm saying if there's a benefit to them on the dyno, than that benefit would be there with just a larger single throttle body too, and you wouldn't have to worry about all the downsides I listed. (balancing, air plenum, maintenance etc)

EFFalcon · 10-07-2006, 01:26 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by fo3oz

interesting, but utterly pointless.

more then one way to get results, a large single throttle body may work, but so does this.
so i'd hardly say its pointless.
not to mention you'd be making a custom manifold to use a 100mm throttle body anyway.

TUFED6 · 10-07-2006, 10:11 AM

Why would it be pointless?

One of the biggest problems with plenum chambers is getting the throttle body positioned so that intake charge flows equally into all cylinders. This inlet solves that problem.

This manifold would have LESS balancing problems than a typical EA or BBM manifold.

All it needs is an airbox (which I'm sure the owner has thought of) and some velocity stacks. The only way you could make this mod cooler is if it used slides instead of butterflies.

Just because the 4.0 isn't a large revving motor doesn't mean that it doesn't consume a lot of air at full noise. Look at some of the gigantic turbo's that they are able to spool at SFA revs.

As for fuel economy, streetability, etc. The short runners probably sacrifice torque, any loss in economy would be from problems with the tune- something that can be sorted out on the dyno.

gthofan · 10-07-2006, 10:23 AM

come on guys, at least he's trying something different to the standard line, what are good extractors, what filter should i get, should i go turbo??

i give him credit for even setting up the idea, isnt it good to try new things, and stand out for having something different?

Walkinshaw · 10-07-2006, 10:26 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by fo3oz

.....I'm saying if there's a benefit to them on the dyno, than that benefit would be there with just a larger single throttle body too....

Bzzz sorry wrong.

Best you stop now. It's blatently obvious you have no idea behind the rational of using an ITB system. The fact that the stock 6's 63mmTB flows enough air for the manafold to maintain 96-99KPa under WOT is not the point.

Gunns · 10-07-2006, 11:43 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Psycho Chicken

*snip*

Gold!

Simmo · 10-07-2006, 12:40 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Psycho Chicken

fo3oz wins some sort of retard award for the month.

i'm actually going to go against the grain on this forum and welcome someone who doesnt instantly cave to the postcounts and egos on this forum. it's supposed to be a place where we can all come and discuss fords, etc. yet you're calling him a retard for sticking to his guns with the info he has. he's put forward some valid points and some not so valid ones. i'd prefer to see a little more support here as lately it seems people are queuing up to jump all over these people so they get what i call 'points' with the forum and its member.

Joes_meat · 10-07-2006, 12:59 PM

A problem with any single throttle body/carb is that it sits in the middle of the intake manifold. This means that the cylinders in the middle (3,4) get slightly more air than 1,2,5,6. This means that you have to run slightly rich or the middle two will lean out (slightly).

Other than that - I can't really see any benifit over a single large TB.

Walkinshaw · 10-07-2006, 01:04 PM

Two words.

Wave Theory

Aaron_EF8 · 10-07-2006, 01:05 PM

Yes that is true, but there's a difference to discussing whats better, and slagging everyone else who disagrees with him.

'Just because you don't understand something, Does not make it wrong'

The obvious 2 disadvantages of IR setups is cost and packaging the TB's within the engine bay. You would also find that if they're setup properly, an IR setup will have more midrange torque than a motor with one larger TB. If this wasnt the case, would virtually every NA racecar, and some of the worlds best performance cars use IR setups?